Upper House Speaker Ekwe Ethuro rates performance of Senate under his watch

Ekwe Ethuro  PHOTO: COURTESY

The Standard: What’s the biggest achievement of the Senate over the past nine months?

Ethuro: I think we have achieved a lot. First, we must understand where we began. This is an institution which is being re-enacted after 50 years. It is basically establishing structures. Even as we speak, we are still in our temporary offices at Kenyatta International Convention Centre. Our offices are still under construction. But we have been able to generate about ten Bills, some are under consideration, some are yet to go for first reading. These are Bills generated by individual senators.

We have brought senators together to try work for the national good devoid of partisan political party interests which I think is a very good starting point for consideration of issues. We have fought the issue of allocation to counties which is one of the core functions given to the Senate under article 96(1) of the Constitution.

On the Division of Revenue Bill, the Senate proposed Sh258 billion for the counties. The proposal from the National Assembly was Sh210 billion. That’s what was enacted. That means, there’s a gap of Sh48 billion. Did the counties lose?

You will appreciate that the Division of Revenue Bill was approved by the National Assembly and sent to the Senate and rightly so. We conducted a very elaborate process in terms of inviting the National Treasury and the Ministry of Devolution, and the public’s views, and looked at the budget requirements of the counties. That Sh258 billion is what we thought was the minimum to make counties operate like before. We were not adding anything new. We were just saying that if certain counties were to maintain the hospitals which traverse more than one county then they need the amounts of money and the delivery of services, then that was the minimum.

Of course money will never be enough, it is a matter, which in our view, we can never disagree. Sh210 billion was one proposal, Sh190 billion was another, Sh258 billion was our proposal. There could even be more proposals. In terms of counties needing money, they definitely need more money to go into development. Our proposal was to give the counties the minimum possible to start them off. We did not realize that.

You went to the Supreme Court…

We set the principle right, which is that Senate had a role to play in legislating on the Division of Revenue Bill. That role was being contested that’s why we went to the Supreme Court. You (the media) decided to call our different proposals supremacy wars. It is unfortunate to use that term because it derails the process. What was critical for us is that counties require a decent resource envelope, and we’ll pursue that one for sure.

The Legal Affairs and Human Rights Committee came up with constitutional amendments to shore up the powers of the Senate, where are we with the Bill to amend the Constitution?

I am a bit constrained to discuss contents of a committee Bill because they need to make a report to the House for the House to make a resolution…for a constitutional amendment, there’s a whole process that has to be followed.

The Speaker of the National Assembly has said the Supreme Court’s advisory opinion is just that –an opinion—that it is not binding. What do you say to that?

We went to court because there were differences on how we were interpreting the Constitution especially the role of the Senate in the Division of Revenue Bill. We were not looking for who wins and who loses. We went to the Supreme Court for an advisory opinion, it was not an accusation—it was saying these are the matters, we have a disagreement and that’s the only place we get to go.

I just want to remind Kenyans that a democracy operates on institutions. You don’t want to start throwing words, throwing stones or looking for spears to fight. This is a democracy. This is a civilized society. We’re pleased the court agreed with our opinion and that opinion is binding to all State organs. I am personally persuaded that nobody can disregard such decisions coming from the Supreme Court.

I must confirm that Speaker Muturi and I are very good friends at a personal level. The differences may be in the way we read the Constitution and the role of each House.

Do we expect more squabbles over interpretations of the law?

You must also appreciate that we are all starting. This is a new thing. A bicameral system was never there. The National Assembly may be used to a one House kind of arrangement, and so, you know, change -for those of us who are students of sociology-- change is not always easy, it takes a while. There are those who pick it fast, there are those who we call laggards, to me these are just teething problems.

We hear the Senate wants to form a Senate Service Commission to run its affairs separate from the Parliamentary Service Commission. What’s all this about?

Those are some of the options that we are considering to make sure that, for purposes of economy and efficiency, that each House is autonomous in its operations and day-to-day running of things is not interfered with.  If you look at the bicameral systems in the World, our system is different. I am personally persuaded that we need one PSC but the PSC can have other commissions assisting the PSC.

Some MPs and media commentators say we should scrap the Senate. What’s your response?

Those who say so are completely undemocratic elements who want to take us back to where we started. And at a time when we are celebrating 50 years of independence, it is really sad that someone can talk like that.

The experiment that we tried at independence and abolished the Senate  and majimbo (regional government) obviously did not work. That’s why seven out of every ten Kenyans voted for this Constitution. One of the key elements in this Constitution is devolution, in the sense that we want services to get close to the people, you want the country to develop, you want equity, you want self-governance, all the objects and principles of devolution.

The Senate has committees. What do they do?

All committees have their mandate with different ministries, and they are working. Of course some have more issues depending on the issues that take place in the nation. I feel I cannot say this one has worked better than the other. All of them have dealt with the matters, they have submitted reports they have been very active, I am very impressed.

Are you happy with the relations with the Executive?

We relate very well with the Executive. The chairmen of the Senate committees are very happy that every time they have summoned a Cabinet Secretary, the Cabinet secretaries always come.

Do you get inadequate responses from the Executive on issues raised by Senators?

We have a lot of that, as Parliament we need to engage the Executive so they provide information in a timely and adequate manner. Senators and MPs represent people, the electorate. Even if you’re not elected, your party picks you, so you’re elected in a way.

Are you a Jubilee Speaker?

I am definitely Jubilee 100 per cent, but I appreciate that when you are on the chair, you are the Speaker.

In fact, my members of the Speaker’s Panel come from across the political divide, and I don’t expect them –and they are practicing politicians-when they are on the chair to do otherwise. We have rules of procedure to follow.

If your commitment is to the rule of law and constitutionalism, you should not be seen like a supporter of a particular party.

Your pick for best senator? Worst senator?

I wish I was a principal of an elementary school, I would gladly do so. But in the business we are in, you wouldn’t want to really engage.

Of course some senators seem to be performing better than others, but I wouldn’t want to name them now. It is an idea we’ll have to work on some framework on how to reward exception contribution, determination, sheer hard work, a commitment to parliamentary work, these are parameters that we need to think through.

What next for the Senate?

We are excited that we’re in town; we are through with the teething problems, with the establishment.

As we close the year, we agreed that next year we want to see more action in terms of ensuring all these challenges of implementing devolution are ironed out so that county governments can roll out their programmes more effectively.

How do you want the people to rate the Senate in the next one year? What are the targets?

I wouldn’t want to say rate us on the basis of one, two, or three things, for now. But I want, God-willing, next year if you can come back, we’ll say this is what we have done over the past one year. The jury is out there, it is the Kenyans who will rate us. We’re looking forward to a positive rating.

Do we need the nominated senators, because, they don’t have a vote per se when it comes to matters affecting counties?

We need them. Article 27 was not just put there to be an irritant. It was put there because of a fundamental principle of gender equity. The outcome of the General Election tells us the story. You must be blind not to see. No single woman was elected governor; no single woman was elected senator. What does that tell you?

The issue of voting…

All the 47 counties, each county has one vote, that’s the principle. In fact, the nominated senators, who are members of a particular county, can still vote for their county on behalf of the leader of delegation, who is the elected senator, when he is not present.

But on general matters, they can vote. The Senate is a House that has the primary responsibility of ensuring equality and equity in the nation.